Brood in flow frames really a problem?

Thats a simple one @Dan2, beekeeping supplies mostly cater to commercial operations and telescopic lids don’t stack well on pallets with the limited space available on trucks.

I can get lids here that are “migratory”, in that they do not telescope, being the same size as the top of the super, but they have no holes in them at all. I can also get the standard “migratory” lid with the holes.

recently I purchased commercial quality wax dipped hives from Victoria- the lids had no ventilation. I drilled holes and put screened vents in them. So far my bees havn’t propolised them.

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I must have linked this 50 times- you’ve probably read it- but to me it sounds an interesting theory - with a way to modify migratory lids with insulation. As you use screened bottoms already this could be an interesting experiment for you? All you’d need to do is insulate the lid.

http://www.theabk.com.au/articles/2016/7/28/a-package-of-minor-changes-to-langstroth-hives-for-major-benefits

Insulating the roof seems a good idea: hold in the winter warmth- keep out the blasting summer sun. No chimney affect.

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Hi Rod, you mean @skeggley :smiley:

Think I meant @SnowflakeHoney

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Thanks for attaching this Jack, I have a copy of the ABK at home where this was published, it was the main reason why I altered all my hives and am still continuing, pitched rooves for the lid insulation, screened bottom boards (stainless mesh and bluebees), all hives raised off the ground and a bottom board skirt for any breeze or wind.
Having re-read it (ta for that), I missed the 8-9mm bee gap in the roof, but that’s a lot of work so I think I’ll stick to the hive mats in the supers for now.
The only concern I have now is the mis-alignment of frames between the brood box and supers. I use 10 frames in the brood and 9 frames in the super, I am just not sure what this does to the air circulation, the moist warm air can still rise from the brood nest however the frames in the super partial block the free travel of this air thus potentially lowering the efficiency of the circulating hive ventilation. May be its just not a big deal…

You’d hope not! Bees must be used to working with greatly varying arrangements- and hives of all shapes.

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They say you can’t improve on nature, if that was the case then evolution would cease to exist. hehe… :blush:

Hi Dan, sometimes on a real cold morning, you’d think that the honey super is empty of bees. That’s not really the case at times. It’s just that more bees are required to keep the brood warm. As the day warms up, more bees will move into the honey super.

In relation to the design of the migratory lid, coupled with a hive mat, I think it is perfect. It has so many things going for it. The bees propolize it down. The extra bee space lets you know if the population is blowing out. I’m always using the flat surface as a work bench. You can stack another hive on top. Use it as a temporary floor when making a split, if you don’t have a bottom board on hand.

absolutely agree Jeff, sometimes the Flow super contains just a handful of bees on freezing spring mornings (I like to shine a torch in and see to the other end of the box to do a head count), and the other bees are busy keeping the brood warm down in the brood box I guess. Only the tough ones are up top in the cold. The other time to see a Flow super nearly empty of bees, is in the morning after a prime swarm has taken off the previous day.

I like it too Jeff, aesthetically as well actually, however others will disagree no doubt, preferring a telescopic lid or another sort. Also they probably like the extra rain protection from an overhanging roof.

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Hi Rod, doesn’t your hive mat on the brood box block much of the circulation up into the super anyhow? Far more than any misaligned frames surely?

Hi Dan, don’t let anyone tell you that a telescopic lid has more weather protection. The bees do a beautiful job of weather protecting a migratory lid with propolis. I have one telescopic lid. I don’t like using it. It might be ok if I used a crown board as well. But without a crown board, a telescopic lid is harder to break the propolis seal when removing it, compared to a migratory lid.

@Rodderick, the bees direct the air to where they’d have it to go rather than air find it’s own direction to flow. I believe that is the reason why we see the odd gap in honey frames & those gaps are created by the bees to allow them to circulate air through.

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Good point @Dan2 Dan, might have to re-think the hive mat over the super and move to padding out the migratory lid.

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Years ago I was running 50+ hives on a semi commercial basis. At that time I ran 2 full depth 10 frame hives for brood with a QX on that and up to 3 boxes for honey. As the honey boxes were often full after a couple of weeks from being extracted I can’t agree that a QX is a barrier if they are kept clean. Drones and the queen are kept where they should be. Beyond a 2 box brood box I feel that the extra space for the queen to lay may be a bit much for her to lay. My hives were always strong with bearding being common. The entrance resembled a traffic jam.
Regards

Thanks Peter for the info on Queen Excluders. I now have one of the metal wire ones and the gaps are larger than on the plastic one I had originally so I will have no hesitation in using it.

I also ordered a few metal QXs, and found the metal edges leave quite a gap between the boxes.
Is that gap an issue? I can actually look through that gap out the other side.
Any idea how I can seal it?

Most of mine are framed with wood, like this:
https://www.brushymountainbeefarm.com/Wooden-Bound-Queen-Excluder

You could probably find some wood trim, cut a groove in it to take the metal edges and make something similar yourself. I know that you have woodworking skills in the family. :wink:

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Leave it for the bees to fill in the gap if the draft is annoying them, let nature take its course.
Regards

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Hi, what if I had to drill an upper entrance on the inner cover?
This should speed up the bees in filling the super…

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