Mold after Dead Out

Help!
Sadly, I have found that my Flow Hive experienced a dead-out over the winter. All signs point to the bees likely dying after a very sudden drop to negative 15 degrees (F) for a period of several weeks in January. I have since added a new nuc to the brood box, but have found mold in the flow frames. Some of the frames still have quite a bit of capped honey mixed with uncapped, molded cells. Obviously I’ll have to manually clean out the flow channels. I’m wondering what I should do with the honey and if I need to attempt to clean out the uncapped cells, or if the new bees will take care of this. Also, what is the best and safest way to clean these? Thank you in advance!

Hi Joe, welcome to the forum and sorry to hear your colony didn’t make it. It’s a bit after the fact to say this, but the Flow super should not be on during winter because of the risks of propolis, pests, and mold. Another big reason to remove it is that the bees will potentially move up to feed on the honey but leave the queen behind to die because she cannot get through the excluder. But, if you take off the excluder and the colony survives - the queen could start laying eggs up there.

If you keep in mind the fact that the system was developed in a subtropical climate, for a subtropical climate - where there’s at least some nectar flowing year-round and no freezing weather, it makes sense that we in the northern hemisphere would need to make adjustments. Such as taking off the Flow super after the last harvest in fall, and thereby avoiding all those issues that arise when the colony needs to cluster and ride out the winter.

Regardless, below zero is COLD! How do other beekeepers in your area winter their colonies over? Here in PA it can get to single digits, so I insulate the tops and sides and feed winter patties in addition to their honey stores.

As for cleaning out your Fframes, harvest whatever honey is still in there and I guess toss it since it has to pass through the moldy channels…to clean thoroughly you may need to dismantle them, scrub and reassemble. Some have used the Flow key wrapped in a thin scrubbing cloth to clean the channels.

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Thank you for your response, Eva!

I had read conflicting advice when it came to the Flow Super, so I opted to leave it on out of an abundance of caution. That said, I left on the queen excluder because I too was worried about the queen laying eggs up there. In essence, by excluding the queen from that honey supply really did none of them any good I guess.

Supposing I harvest the Flow Super in the fall and remove it for winter storage, any thoughts on how I prevent it from getting mold in it during storage?

Thank you, Eva! I truly appreciate your insight!

I wouldn’t worry too much about the mold, the bees will clean it up very quickly when you put it on the hive. If you drain the frames before storing them, the chance of mold is much reduced. However, there are a few things that you can do. If you have loads of freezer space, store the Flow frames in the freezer over winter. I wrap them in plastic wrap first. Then defrost for 24 hours in the Spring before you put them back on the hive.

Another option is to store in a dry garage or shed, in the dark to protect the plastic. Of course, there is no reason why you couldn’t keep them in the house if you wanted to. A heated interior over winter will be a pretty dry atmosphere, and not conducive to mold growth.

I would suggest that you have double deeps for brood though, so that your bees will have enough food stores for winter. If you don’t have that already, I would put the second brood box on this year, before you add the Flow super.

I wish you better luck for this year!

Thank you, Dawn!

The second brood box is a great suggestion, and will buy me some time to clean the mold out of the flow channels. You think it’s safe to keep the mold in the flow frames/cells?

Safe for the bees, yes. Hives always have mold in them. Without a photo of the frame faces, it is hard to say though. You should clean out the Flow harvest channels, as you suggested. If you are worried about the amount of mold, you could try a pressure washer from a couple of feet away, but as @Eva suggested, if the mechanisms are jammed up with propolis, you may have to dismantle everything to get rid of it, otherwise your next harvest will be a nightmare… :wink:

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Thanks again, Dawn!

I have attached a couple pictures of the frames for referencing.

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That doesn’t look too bad to me. I would just clean out the harvesting channels, wipe off what you can, and reinstall them when the second brood box is full. :blush:

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Thank you so much, Dawn!

I appreciate your time and insight!!

You might also want to put a toothpick into a Flow cell to see if the honey is crystallized. If it is, you are going to have a bigger clean up job… :cry:

Greetings, Dawn!

If that is the case, harvest/drain all the honey and let the bees do the cleanup?

If it is crystallized, you will not be able to drain it. You will either have a find a way to feed it to the bees in the frames, or try pressure washing, or dismantle and clean them out. The feeding to the bees option is complicated, and chances of success will depend on your current nectar flow and the state of your brood box. If the brood box is relatively empty of honey stores, you could try putting the super back on the hive, after scratching off the caps. Sometimes the bees will then move the honey down, if there isn’t much in the brood nest area. However, if your nectar flow is strong right now, that probably won’t work. You will know your local situation better than me. :blush:

Oh dear… fingers crossed! :grimacing:

One more thought @JoeR, do you have a Varroa management plan?

Looking at your Flow frames, there is a lot of food in there. A researcher once put a cluster of bees into a -20°C (-4°F) freezer to euthanize them. This is an approved method. However, the cluster was relatively big, and had enough food on board to survive the experience!

So my point is that if there was all that food in the hive, could something else have killed your bees? There is a very good article here, which is worth a read:

https://beeinformed.org/2016/03/08/why-did-my-honey-bees-die/

Hope that gives you some more information :blush:

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Thank you for this, Dawn!

Upon inspection, I didn’t notice a heavy presence of Varroa mites. While there was ample honey up top, I wonder if leaving the excluder on starved the queen? The -15 degree temperatures came on very quick and lasted a couple of weeks in January. This said, I would love to get your thoughts on a product that you use to feed your colony during the wintertime and what you use to treat the Varroa mites. Many products I have looked at are not available in the US or they seem to un-natural to me.

Thank you for thinking of me, Dawn! I’ll get this down!

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They’re not easy to spot, but we can count on them being there because they’ve been endemic in the US for decades. If you ever can see them, by that time the infestation is out of control.

Sadly that’s very possible.

Anyway, you have a whole new season for a do-over. There are several effective mite treatments and strategies out there, but my personal recommendation is using oxalic acid in some form. There’s a ton on info about this here and elsewhere on the web. Now is the time to do your research and get started with a plan :sunglasses:

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I’m on it!

What’s your favorite supplement for wintertime feeding?

Cheers, Eva!

If I have to feed, I use leftover honey from my own apiary, dry sugar, and/or winter patties (low protein pollen substitute + sugar + vitamins).

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My climate is very different from yours, down here in SoCal, so I can use sugar syrup all winter. You would do better following @Eva’s advice. :wink:

I also agree with her that oxalic acid is my favorite treatment. There is a magnifying glass at the top of the page that you can use to search the forum for it. I have found that shop towels or swedish dish cloths are the easiest way to apply it, but vaporizing it works well too. You should think about getting a kit to do a sugar roll or alcohol wash once your colony is stronger. That will give you a much better insight into mite numbers than just eyeballing the bees. :blush:

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