You could probably drill a couple of drain holes in the base board and core flute to let the water drain?
If it is really important to prevent your bees swarming, I wouldn’t only rely on giving them an extra brood box.
More space may mean that the colony gets much larger and when it swarms will produce larger swarms…
Combine with frequent checks in the swarm period, splitting or brood removal. Consider also clipping your queen as that will make a prime swarm return to the hive.
Queen clipping isn’t widely practiced in Australia and is considered barbaric by many including me.
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Fair enough, I just said consider it. Its standard practice in much of the world where beekeepers want to limit the losses and nuisance caused by swarming bees.
Balance that against the damage caused to native fauna referenced in the post I replied to.
Hi @skeggley, would you mind advising what the main issues you have found with the Flow Hive are. I have one coming and would rather address them before bees go in if I can. I am also on the verge of buying a second, I wouldn’t mind your opinion on that. Am new to the game but most of the advice is to set up at least 2 hives to start. cheers mate.
I understand it’s still widely practiced outside of Australia, I’ve just never had it suggested to me by any other beekeepers, and I’ve seen recommendations against it’s use in our beekeeping literature where it’s described as a largely pointless exercise.
As for the damage to native flora, well I’m afraid the cat was let out of the bag sometime in the early 1800’s in regards to bees but the damage they have done or continue to do is much less than from most other exotic flora or fauna brought here around the same time.
Hey mate, thanks for that. What’s the reason for that advice? Do you harvest off the WSP? I was going to leave the QX above the second box all year… well then I remove the Flow super in winter.
I actually got rid of the corflute altogether, so water can go straight through. I’m not a fan of the design of the Flow bottom board, at least the the original like the ones I have.
Yeah. A bit of a controversial topic as @Stevo mentioned. I rather not do it. I am curious how many times I may have to split a double brood box in a season if they decide to go ballistic. Having said that, for me swarming is not an option as native wildlife is far more important than bees, which are after all not native here.
I’m in agreement with you and Steve, I have not come across anyone in Australia that clips the queens but in some countries it seems to be normal practice. I don’t see how that will prevent swarming if the urge hits the colony.
I ran double brood hives for 35 years in a different climate and 12 years with singles since then. From my experience a double brood hive will swarm at least every season if the conditions suit that happening but I had to take splits more often in a strong season. I was semi commercial back then so my splits were used to increase my hive numbers as well as environmental reasons.
Now with single brood hives and a longer productive season I have to do more splits to prevent swarming happening. With so much increase in interest in bee keeping I put the split in a full sized brood hive and when a new queen is made and laying it is very easy to sell.
Cheers
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I have heard of clipping the wings of a queen but don’t know of anyone doing it in Australia. So my question is that in a hive with a clipped queen prior to swarming the bees have new queen cells in use as normal. So about 1/2 the bees take off in a swarm and as they don’t have the queen with them as she is left behind what happens to the new queens that would emerge? Do they fight to the death with the old queen? So the prime swarm returns to the hive and still over crowding exists if that was one of the reasons for the swarming.
Asking just from interest as I have no experience with a clipped wing queen hive.
Cheers
Hiya BC1956, welcome to the forum.
I think Flow frames are a great product and have had no issues when harvesting with the method advised, tried and tested here on the forum.
But, there’s always a but.
Harvesting is only a very small part of beekeeping. Bee husbandry is what it’s all about. It can be expensive, time consuming, hard work on hot days but a rewarding and addictive hobby never the less. It is not set and forget. Like any livestock or pet you have a duty of care to your bees, neighbours and fellow beeks. You MUST also register your hives with the Ag Dept.
Hi there Brent I agree with the above that the Flow frames are a great invention. I personally had a lot of problems with manufacturing and quality control… a long list which I won’t go through again. My gripes are stemmed from this. Others weren’t as unlucky and will have a different view.
I harvested according to the instructions supplied but still had a lot of honey leaks which caused problems in the brood nest. The problem was that the wires that keep the frames together were too loose, and they sag with the weight of honey. Every single frame I received had wires too loose, and when they fill with honey they bow causing leaks. A tiny amount of honey leaking is not a problem at all and bees deal with it, but drowning them in honey as it happened to me is undesirable. Fixing wire tension when the frames are in use as Flow suggested to me is not a straightforward job. So make sure that you have correct wire tension on the frames. My experience would have been a lot more positive if the Flow frames were quality controlled before they were shipped and not ruin my entire first season trying to trouble shoot problems and dreading harvesting instead of enjoying it.
You also have to be aware of other limitations. For example cycling frames from brood box to the super to get rid of old comb is not straight forward because they are not compatible. There are workarounds. Same if you want to make splits and want an extra frame of honey, you can’t take one from the super. If you plan a second hive, which I highly recommend, a standard Langstroth might be a good idea so that you can use it as a donor hive if needed.
At the end for me it is great because I don’t have to clean and store other harvesting equipment so I work around it’s limitations. And BTW…. whatever you read that with Flow Hives you do not disturb the bees, it is complete nonsesne. You HAVE TO disturb the bees and inspect whatever hive you have as good husbandry is what really matters, as the chap above said.
I’m not aware of any damage to native flora by bees. They are however aggressive towards fauna. It’s disappointing when they drive out or kill a common native animal or bird from a hollow but it can be devastating in areas with endangered species. I think it is our duty to take care and not add to the problem. I often talk to the park managers here and they mention bees as one of their major problems along with cats, foxes rabbits and weeds. As beekeepers we tend to turn a blind eye to bees being a problem and apparently not eeryone is aware of problems they can cause in natural parks.
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The reason for moving qx is to restrict the queen in the lower box during spring/summer for easier inspection purposes and back up to allow the queen access during winter.
I move the qx in some hives but not others and have found the top box mainly honey anyway.
Generally I don’t harvest the WSP but may during spring to keep the bees on their toes.
This practice was recommended when one of my colonys struggled during a summer dearth and has worked well although I haven’t really experienced another dearth since then.
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Hi @skeggley, thanks for reply and welcome. Yes I realise it is not just about the honey and have not just jumped straight in without a lot of research, courses etc and am registered. I was just getting a tad nervous with some of the issues expressed with harvesting Flow. Flow just seemed a little more convenient when it came to harvest.
I was a little concerned on asking questions on Flow as it appears to be their set up and did not know whether answers would be biased, however, there seems to be some good info here and not as put down on the Flow from some stuff.
It would be nice to see a bit more content from West Aussies on the site though to pick up on local knowledge.
Cheers
This is my point. According to whose instructions? Flows or this forums?
I have harvested both 1st and 2nd generation Fframes numerous times and have never had this issue. 4 seasons.
I have never opened the whole Fframe in one hit and I wouldn’t be the least surprised that if I did, it would leak.
I have never harvested more than 2 frames in one hive in one day.
And as for the wooden ware, yes I had issues with this also but nothing I couldn’t rectify with little fuss. I have seen some harbingers on this forum though. 
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Yes I jumped in the deep end also.
My first cut out.
Yes, I got stung.
I have improved on Fframes by producing an automatic harvester now.
Does cost a bit in food though…
Glad you’ve registered and I’m sure the fellow Sandgropers are still around but probably lurking. 
Wait until the season starts up it could get busy.
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Hi @Honeyeater, thanks for reply. The main reason I went for Flow was the same as you were saying. I was looking at following straight on this season and getting another. But now in a bit of a quandry.
I didn’t particularly want to set up a full standard Langstroth as then I need extractor, strainer etc and thought that sort of defeats the purpose of going for a Flow. What are you doing?
Was wondering if to put a second super on when it was needed, then could use frames from that and reduce the hive down in winter.
All seems to be a learning curve. Cheers
That’s a different take on a honeypot 
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Am interested in you auto harvester. Any reason you don’t use Flow roofs?
I only bought the 1 founding full flow the rest just the super alone, hybrids that are being modified to 6 Fframe supers, next time just the Fframes, so only have 1 Flow roof but prefer the migratory tops which are easily insulated and interchangeable. And don’t leak. 
Also does away with the inner cover which I only use for feeding if required.
Only standard solid bottom boards also, I see no purpose for screened bb’s here in the West except for wax moth harvesting.
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All good cheers 