You can ‘feel’ a smaller colony is calmer because there will be less angry bees hassling you. What makes a colony angry is the genetics of the queen, the present and recent weather and I suspect soon to happen weather as well, I think my bees can sense a thunderstorm hours before I hear it. Another factor is local conditions and the availability of nectar and pollen, in a dearth a hive becomes defensive of what they have in the hive and can go further to become a robbing mind set hive. That’s my theory.
Cheers
That makes sense of course Peter, and I also thought that a smaller colony can’t afford to loose bees fighting as much as a larger one, so they are more reluctant to attack. Maybe I’m wrong.
My question to Dawn or anyone with double brood boxes was whether a massive colony is even more likely to turn aggressive than a smaller typical one brood box colony with similar temperament.
I think it is a fair question for anyone keeping hives in an urban environment, especially with kids and pets around.
I based my original reply on experience of 30+ years with double brood hives in the Hawkesbury district west of Sydney where the cold Winter climate meant you needed a double brood hive to survive the longer and colder Winter, where I live now where Winter means a long sleeved shirt and jeans instead of shorts and a T shirt.
Cheers
In my experience, no. The size of the colony doesn’t make them mean.
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Thanks Dawn that’s very good to know.
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I live in a leafy suburb in Brisbane - mild winters overall. I started my hive in November last year, had a swarm 8 weeks later.
After re-queening I added a second brood box about 7-8 weeks ago - last week the top box seemed pretty full of bees with the queen there, but the bottom box was not so full of bees.
To keep the brood warm over winter I was thinking of swapping the brood boxes around, putting the queen excluder between the two brood boxes, waiting three weeks for the brood on the (now) top box to hatch and then take the top brood box off and winter over with just one brood box and the honey super.
Any thoughts out there about this? ok to swap brood boxes around, it won’t confuse the queen?
In Brisbane there is no reason for a double brood box, our so called Winter is not cold enough to need a double brood box. Not the right time to make a split of the two brood boxes with Winter coming on but neither is a double brood hive with no more brood cluster than in a single brood hive.
I would find the queen and put her into the brood box below a QX, the box she isn’t in put above the QX and come Spring learn how to do a preemptive hive split to deduce the risk of swarming.
Cheers
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Hi Peter
Thank you for your reply.
The reason I put the second brood box on was to reduce the chance of a second swarm.
I am trying to get my head around this - I was told that the reason to reduce the brood boxes from two to one was the opposite of what you are saying - to make it easier for the hive to keep the temperature high over winter (long range forecast is slight warmer winter at least until July) by reducing the volume of the hive. You are saying the reason to have a second brood box is keep the hive warm which you don’t need to do anyway in this area.
I will do as you suggest and put the queen in the bottom box.
Many thanks
Chris
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Hi Chris, I guess I didn’t explain myself well enough. In our climate it doesn’t get cold enough to have a second brood box and a single brood box is much easier to manage. Look at it this way, a bit of a reverse to your thinking. Our Winters are so mild in bee terms that there is no need for a double brood hive, for a hobbyist there is no advantage, better to make a split of a double hive and have a second hive in good weather.
I didn’t say a second brood box would keep the cluster warmer. It makes for more space for the bees to keep the brood area warmer.
I would make sure the queen is below the QX, and put the brood box with the most brood above the QX without the queen.
Having a double brood box hive doesn’t mean you will double the honey yield. If that is what you want then two hives is the way to go.
Hope that explains it ok.
Cheers
Me too. Was it the second brood box you were told to remove over winter, or the super? I thought that you have an extra brood box for winter to have enough food stored, and remove the super so they have less space to keep warm.
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Remove the second brood box. The super holds the honey store for over winter so that always stays. If the two brood boxes were overflowing with bees I wouldn’t do anything but my impression was one of the boxes was a bit under populated so my main concern is keeping the hive warm
(I read that if you ask three beekeepers the same question you’ll get 4 different answers). Some seem keen on two brood boxes + a super and some don’t like the idea. I don’t think my suburban garden will fit two bee hives so splitting the hive is not really an option. I’m checking the hive again on Monday and post what I decided
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Can’t see any reason why you would remove a brood box for winter.
Remember the brood nest is a football shape and is surrounded, or insulated, with their stores so the stores can be easily accessed by the clustering colony.
If you left a super on the qx would need to be removed then, there’s a chance you may get eggs laid in the super. Then, it’s not a super anymore. 
When I was in the Hawkesbury and hives there and at Mudgee in those climates everyone had double brood boxes for warmth and to maintain the brood size(as much as possible).
My brother in the Southern Highlands in NSW always removes the bottom brood box and fits it above the QX checking that the queen is on the brood frames with the cluster, His brood cluster is very reduced over his Winters and the bottom brood box becomes empty of brood. The brood box moved up become a honey frame for Winter and in the Spring the older frames are removed, extracted and rendered down for the wax. It works for him.
Up here on the Sunshine Coast of Qld I have single brood hives and no reduction of brood over Winter.
It is all about the climate where the hives are and a single or double brood hive is for each to decide what is best for them and their bees.
Cheers
Ok, that makes sense, so it’s a method of cycling the frames out. Fresh frames in the brood box every 2 years.
So if the cluster has reduced and located in the top box it’d be early winter that this is done? Are they empty frames in the lower box? If this is the case then why not just remove it to reduce the hive volume?
To be honest I don’t think I’ve done a winter inspection so am unfamiliar with where the cluster sits during the cooler period. I thought one of the reasons they move up was following the food.
I’m currently seeing good arguments for using single brood boxes. I’m cleaning frames from an abandoned (by the owner) 2 brood hive. You can clearly see that the 2 brood hive got set up & never had a brood check after that, going by the amount of old unused combs in the bottom box. By the time you remove the old unused combs containing large percentages of drone comb as well as pollen bound frames, you’re back to a single brood box.
One reason the brood didn’t get checked could be the daunting task of doing it. You get a huge population by using double brood boxes, therefore the thought of inspecting 16-20 brood frames with a huge population can be very daunting. Especially if the colony has a little bit of attitude.
Single brood hives are the way to go in my opinion. They are easier to maintain. The task of doing a brood inspection is nowhere near as daunting as it would be with a double brood colony.
When you look at the pros & cons of single brood versus double brood. One still has the capital outlay as well as all the work involved in putting the second brood box together. All that time & money would be better served with a second colony.
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I think my hive has made the decision for me - I opened the hive this afternoon - the top box box looks healthy and busy, the bottom box much less so and when i looked at the brood it was all uncapped and the 4-5 frames with larvae all had chalk brood.
Fortunately there was no sign of it on the top box - and I looked really carefully.
So the bottom box will come off and I’ll let those bees join the hive
Any suggestions how I do this? - just put the box on the ground next to the hive and let the bees join the hive
I’ll discard the frames of course.
There is a couple of option about the chalk brood Chris. But the first thing I would do is reduce the brood box to a single by taking the bottom box out. That will be a big help for the colony. I’m up 100 k’s North of you and thou I used to have double brood hives west of Sydney I’m against doubles up here with our mild, almost non existent Winters. I would shake what bees you have on the bottom frames onto the top brood box to save time waiting for the bees to transfer in their own sweet time. With our Autumn warm weather I would move out the bottom brood box to the next up from the QX to have the bees use it for honey storage and likely they will store some honey there before the nectar flow drops out.
Re chalk brood you can beat it but it takes time, I had 3 hives with chalk brood but rather than throw the towel in I spent time to beat it. It wasn’t over night, and with the same issue again not sure I would walk the same path but it was definite learning experience so worth it for that.
The main thing in my opinion is to reduce the amount of spores in the hive, they are everywhere but what we see predominately is dead bees on the brood comb and on the floor.
You can scorch the frames and soak them in bleach rather than dis-guard them if there is a huge amount of infected cells, but I have also spent the time with tweezers picking out dried mummies…
Cheers
Hi Jeff thanks for your thoughts on 1vs 2 brood boxes. I think you looked at it from a commercial angle.
I think a backyard beekeeper might look at things from a different perspective.
What do you think about a horizontal hive for someone with space for one? Brood size is flexible keeping colony strong without the back breaking lifting and disruption of double brood boxes.
When I moved from west of Sydney where Winters were so cold a double brood hive was a must if you wanted the hive to get thru the Winter. When I moved up to Qld I didn’t do the research I should have done so set up double brood hives which was a mistake.
I don’t think Jeff’s points were made from a commercial perspective but more from making bee keeping easier for the bee keeper if the climate is right to set up with single hives.
There is not a lot of difference between a hobby/interest bee keeper really, both aim at doing the best for their hives regardless of how many they have.
From my experience with having double brood hives here then dividing them to single brood hives double brood hives doesn’t equate to twice the honey yield, my yield actually increased when I changed to single brood hives, but conditions could have accounted for that also.
Cheers
Hi Perth, I’m not looking at it from a commercial angle at all. The capital outlay & time involved in putting the extra box & frames together is only part of it. It’s the other things I mentioned that are worth serious consideration.
It’s my belief that a lot of hobby beekeepers neglect to do brood inspections as often as they should. A brood inspection on a single brood can be daunting and made harder if not done regularly, on account of propolis & wax buildup. Imagine how daunting it would be to think about a brood check on a double brood, especially if it hasn’t been done for a while, considering the propolis & wax buildup between the frames.
Yes I like the idea of a long lang hive for someone who has the room & doesn’t need to move it around. It would simplify brood inspection, that’s for sure.
cheers