Bees discarding Pupae/ lavae our the front of the hive (new hive)

So this hive is now into its third week since I installed the package and have (to the best of my knowledge) been doing well, they have been collecting pollen, drawing out frames and on my week 1 inspection I could see eggs being laid in the cells as well as cells being filled with nectar/ honey.

Fast-forward to this morning (2 weeks 3 days since package install) and I noticed 5-10 larvae on and around the entrance of he hive. As I was on my way to work I simply removed the larvae and started researching. I came to mixed results from normal, bad and ugly.
When I returned home this afternoon i inspected again to find another ~5 larvae and 1 pupae near the entrance, as I was inspecting the workers dragged out another 2 pupae that looked close to developed. None of the larvae looked “chalky” and could see anything out of the ordinary. there have been a few hive beetles I’ve seen but never more than 3 when opening and I usually kill them off. I pulled out the core flute from the bottom and there was 2 hive beetles and a bunch of wax and a few ants. I can only attach one image due to being new so ill email more pictures to anyone who believes they can help.

The weather has been quite inconsistent the last couple of weeks ranging from 25-35 degree days with high humidity to rainy and humid days. I did have my core flute set on the more “open setting” (flow hive original) and this afternoon put it on the more closed setting in case this was a temperature issue.

1 week inspection

core flute

That’s an awful lot of debris on the coreflute slider. I’m wondering if hive beetles got a chance to do some damage to the brood after your first inspection. Maybe some comb got damaged while you returned the frames, or some bees got trapped between the combs. Beetles breed up in the sort of weather you/we have recently experienced.

I would suggest to do another brood inspection, looking out for any damaged comb. If you find any, cut it out before gently replacing the frames, making sure that you don’t squash any bees between combs, & that no combs are touching each other.

I know that Flow promotes using foundationless frames, however experienced beekeepers will generally advise to use frames with properly fitted foundation, or nice clean fully drawn combs. I say nice & clean, because I’ve seen some shockers. I like frames that are drawn with about 98% worker comb.

Thanks Jeff

In my first inspection there was some comb being build on the inside “side” of the brood box, when trying to remove it i did drop it… :grimacing: it was peobably the size equivalent size of a golfball/ tennis ball so some of the debris could be that, now that ive cleaned the coreflute ill definitely keep an eye on it and once the weather clears up over the weekend ill go in and check for damage and remove it,
I appreciate your advice.

Just another question, do you recommend having the coreflute on the more open setting or the ‘closed off’ setting

And any other tips would be helpful! First hive and all.

You’re welcome Justin. Welcome to the forum as well.

I would keep the slider in the closed position all year round. The bees will be more effective at air conditioning their hive with no added ventilation. Also make sure that the entrance is no greater than 15 in area. You could halve that with a weaker colony.

Another tip would be to clean the screen, if needed during the next inspection.

A couple of good learning videos on youtube are “City of the Bees”, & “Nova, Bees Tales from a Hive”

Hello, and welcome to the Flow forum! :blush:

@JeffH has already given you some excellent advice, and I agree with all of it.

I am afraid that it looks like chalkbrood to me, despite your observation. Just my opinion. I could be wrong, but the main reason for bees pulling our young pupae like that is chalkbrood. If the infection is early, the pupae may not go brittle and hardened with the fungus.

One common cause of chalkbrood is chilled brood. If you inspected on a cool day, or in the rain, or left frames out of the hive for a lengthy period, that can be enough to chill the brood. Just something to consider. Otherwise, consider Jeff’s advice, and hopefully things will clear up pretty soon for you.


Hive beetle are forefront on my mind, on account of hot humid weather that we have recently experienced (the weather that beetles LOVE to breed in), not to mention recent phone calls about slime-outs. Also 2 hive beetles on the core flute slider, plus what looks like macerated bees. It looks clearer on Wilma’s mobile when zoomed in, than it does on my laptop.

That discarded pupae looks to have some missing parts, which would be typical of discarded pupae after hive beetle damage that bees are trying to rectify.
I hope the bees are strong enough in numbers to do so.

Funnily enough, one call we got was from a bloke who wouldn’t believe Wilma & I that the grubs in his hive were hive beetle larvae. Even after he brought some around to show us. He reckoned they were blow fly maggots, on account that some flies were hanging around his hive. We haven’t heard from him since.

I believe the hive is quite strong the package had 12,000 of them and only ~15 dead (old looking) bees have been counted near the hive (not accounting for bees lost during foraging and other ways etc). Within 1 week they had almost filled 3 frames with comb, haven’t checked since due to poor weather and wanting them to do their thing.

I’ve “closed” the core flute and ordered some of the vegetable oil beetle traps to help reduce the adult beetle numbers. Besides removing any damaged comb in the coming week and killing any beetles I see, is there much more I can do to assist them? Afterall they’ve survived for millions of years without us…

I appreciated your knowledge

I think you should do a brood inspection sooner, rather than later, just to remove any damaged comb, containing beetle larvae, and/or eggs. Also check the screen for any grubs, damaged bees or larvae/pupae.

The bloke who didn’t believe me or my wife said that he only saw one beetle in his hive, so therefore it couldn’t be beetle larvae. The other phone calls we got were from slime-outs, which means the colonies didn’t remain in the hives. Beetle slime is a bee repellent, which will result in the colony absconding if it can’t overwhelm the beetle damage.

Yep i think youre spot of jeff, found these on the coreflute just now when i got home

Theres a fair few, whats tge course of action

The course of action would ideally be to get the colony into a different brood box on clean frames with a frame of open brood from another hive. If any of the frames are still good, you can include them.

Try to avoid any of the larvae making it to ground, which is where they will complete their life cycle. Tiny grubs wont amount to much, the big ones will, which are the ones you want to keep away from the ground. Funny enough, the tiny grubs still turn into beetles, however tiny. Studies in Texas concluded that tiny hive beetles are too small to reproduce.

The frame of open brood, if you can get one will help in holding the colony in whatever brood box you decide to use.

Dont have any stored brood the veetles hava massacared everything

The priority will be to prevent the colony from absconding, therefore if you can beg or borrow one from someone, like this afternoon, that would be good.

Dont know of anyone nearby

What i decided to do was I cut out all the useless comb that had been destroyed by beetles and their lavae, killer all the beetled i could find ~25 and lavae

Ive now put back in the “good” frames and left one frame out as i believe the bees were struggling to keep all the comb covered and thus beetle free.

Im going to looking creating a custom beetle trap to last until the ones i bought come in… fingers crossed

Save your time by not creating the custom beetle trap. I don’t use any traps at all. You could use the ones you bought, if you feel you need to catch them.

Looking at your last photo, it appears that the honey hasn’t been slimed, on account that it’s still dry to look at. Discard any honey that has the wet appearance.

I thought of a strategy for you: #1, you want to put the bees in a box that is void of any beetle slime odor. You could use the honey super, minus the flow frames as a temporary brood box. Use the crown board as a bottom board, with the original outside on the inside. Move the super forward, so as to create an entrance under the edge. Then use the frames without any slime for the bees to occupy. You can use a piece of cardboard as a temporary crown board under the flow roof.

It’s worth bearing in mind that the colony was counting on the destroyed brood, in order to keep the population going, those bees are aging. You will need to try to locate another beekeeper so that you can purchase a couple of frames of sealed & emerging bees, so that the population continues.

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Really sorry for the bad luck, Justin. But, welcome to the forum anyway! This is a great place to learn and be encouraged to keep trying til you succeed :sunglasses:


Yeah fingers crossed that they’ll pull through, Im going to put some “swiffer” sheets in this afternoon to hopefully stop the beetles from hiding… I had to cut out half the comb from all but 1 frame as the beetles had destroyed the brood sections. Hopefully there was enough brood on the remaining frame to keep them ticking over, i removed a frame to help keep bee to frame numbers higher but i suppose only time will tell if they make it…
if not it will be disappointing but ill be sure to try again, making sure I install a new package at the start of the season around mid October and not late January

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