This is my first year beekeeping and I wasn’t expecting to harvest honey this year but once July hit, the bees not only took to the Flow Frame but it looks like I’ll need to harvest at least one to two frames in the next ~30 days (feedback from local beekeeper meteor).
Judging by the end frame window, it appears that our Flow Frames are >90% full with honey. When I opened them yesterday to check, however, they’re only about 40-50% capped (in the center of the frames).
Since they filled the frames out so quickly, I’m concerned that there’s going to be a substantial period of time between when they get the honey 100% filled and when they get one or two frames full capped and ready for harvest. More specifically, I’m concerned that too much time will lead them to becoming honey bound, or swarming.
I’m not sure if I should keep cracking open the hive and checking (it did make a bit of a nectar mess) or just use the outside windows to check the ends being capped as a proxy for internal frame capping.
Are my concerns unfounded? Suggestions on timing & next steps?
Separately, I did notice some of the cells honey levels went down day-over-day. Are the bees consuming it or will they relocate/consolidate honey as it’s ready to be capped?
Pics from July 24th, 25th, 29th, and 30th (e.g. one week) to provide a sense of their production speed.
I always lift the Flow frames and inspect the day before I want to extract. Those empty central arcs can cause honey leaks into the hive. For those frames, I wait until the season is over, take the Flow super off the hive, and harvest in my kitchen over a large baking sheet to catch the honey leaks from the frame faces.
As far as the honey moving around, at this time of year, the queen slows down her laying, and the bees backfill the brood nest. So the honey is probably moving to the brood boxes, which a good thing for the bees. Hopefully you have 2 brood boxes on your hive?
Ten days sounds fine, but in your first year, you should probably have been advised to put a second brood box on before adding the honey super. Don’t add one now, it is too late in the season. It is not an impossible situation, but you should take the super off in the early fall, unless you have a good fall nectar flow. You want the queen excluder off over winter, and you don’t want a Flow super on the hive without a queen excluder.
Having just one brood box means that you will very likely need to feed them over winter. I suggest that you use the magnifying glass tool at the top to search for winterizing. That would include insulation, moisture quilts and winter feeding. Also, do you have a plan for managing varroa? You should, because it kills a lot of hives over winter
Adding a second brood box and delay/remove Flow Super is new to me as my understanding from both locals and the Flow Hive team was to keep the Flow Super on over the winter to enable them to use the honey as a food source, leaving at least 5 (of 7) full frames.
I haven’t gotten to the details of winter yet but was planning to feed & insulate.
No plans for varroa at the moment but planning (or hoping schedule align) to do a full hive inspection with local mentor before end of season.
That is fine if you are in a subtropical climate, like the Flow team are. However, in cooler climates, bees will cluster, and the cluster moves to where the honey is during the winter. If you leave the queen excluder on, the queen will be left below it, and may well freeze. If you take the excluder off, you don’t know when she is going to start laying in late winter/early spring, and she may lay in the Flow super which is highly undesirable.
Additionally, bees tend to propolize the Flow frames in late fall, which gums up the mechanism. Plus after a few months, many types of honey will crystalize, which also gums up the mechanism, making the next harvest difficult or impossible. It is just simpler to take the Flow super off when the nectar flows are over. For me, that is mid July to late August, depending on how wet the year has been. Your locals will know better when that is for you.
There are many ways to keep bees successfully, so there will always be differing opinions. I am just offering you a synthesis of the experience of the several thousand members of this forum, and trying to prevent you from suffering an issue that has a work-around
If you have a good goldenrod flow in September, you could leave it on until then. Your locals will know, I don’t - I am in SoCal and I have not seen goldenrod around here. Otherwise take it off when they say the main flow is over. You can harvest 80% full frames on the hive, and then harvest the rest indoors. You can always feed this back to the bees later, if you want. This little summary is quite good, but it might not apply exactly to your location:
If the nectar is done and they need more food, at this time of year I feed 5:3 (sugar to water) sugar syrup, made with white granulated sugar. When night time temperatures drop below 55°F, you need to switch to fondant or some other solid feed. They will not take syrup when it gets colder.
You then have to do a quick check on the hive over winter to monitor their stores. If you are using fondant, you can just lift the lid and see if they need more. Otherwise, you need to learn to “heft the hive” by lifting one edge and estimating how heavy it is. When it feels lighter than you think it should, feed them. The most sophisticated way is to use an internet connected hive scale, but that is a much more expensive option
I guess what’s lingering in my head is that if I take the Flow Super off this year, they’ll only have whatever is in the Brood Box for the majority of their food source (manually augmented likely being the minority).
Given how relatively late in the season it is, for the first winter, would they be better off with the Flow Super and additional food on?
I don’t think so. Many commercial beekeepers just use one box. So does @chau06 in Ohio, who probably has a climate similar to yours. The really important thing is going to be getting control of varroa and winterizing the hive properly. Then you just have to check the food stores regularly to make sure that they are not running out. It is more work, and not something that I would recommend for new beekeepers, but it is perfectly doable
Nice looking feeder, but I am concerned that the bees will have trouble accessing solid sugar from under the central cap. I have never used granulated sugar, but @Eva has, and I believe that she has a very nice method (she is in Pennsylvania). Perhaps she can chime in with some expert advice.
One other thing. You should never ever feed with a super on the hive, unless you like syrup instead of honey. Also some fondants and winter patties have essential oils in them, not something you want in your honey next season, unless you like spearmint, wintergreen etc in your honey!
Also makes sense re: dry sugar. I was also wondering if I could leave the white “cap” off, which would be a similar process to just adding dry sugar on top of the internal cap under the roof… just a lot more sugar.
Just so I’m clear, would your recommended order of operations be;
Let them fully fill & cap the Flow Super, not worrying about them getting honey bound.
Once it’s 100% full, pull off the entire Flow Super [thereby leaving them with just the Brood Box for the rest of the summer/fall season.
Significant food source augmentation for this winter season via dry sugar, local pollen patties, etc.
Next spring, add 2nd brood box before adding Flow Super [and simply remove the Flow Super each year, leaving them with two Brood boxes to self-manage with their own honey supply)
Thanks for taking all your time on this - it’s super helpful and I haven’t been able to find any content only or the Flow YT channel that addresses this for New England winters.
In winter, my main concern with that would be the draft coming down through the center hole chilling the hive. Also, if there is a significant draft, the bees may propolize the hole closed. Unlikely, but possible.
Let me address your numbers points in order:
Close, but not exactly. I would let them fill the Flow super until your local nectar flow is over, whenever that is in your region. Inspect for sure to make sure that they are not honey bound, but you are going to do that anyway, aren’t you? Make sure to inspect the brood box too, not just the super. They may well not fill it 100%. My bees rarely do. Swarming is very unlikely in August in your kind of climate, so you don’t have to worry too much about being honey bound
Again 100% full isn’t the issue. You want a frame at least 80% full and capped before harvesting it. If that is the case you can harvest on the hive, which makes the super a lot lighter when you want to take it off. Plus the bees get any honey spills. Please read the forum for info on harvesting in 25% increments to avoid flooding the hive. Only go down to just the brood box when you know that the nectar flow is over in your region
I would use sugar syrup until around September in your area, which is when night temps reach 55 or less. Only switch to dry sugar at that point. NEVER use pollen patties in fall and winter. They stimulate brood production and the hive can’t handle that. Either use fondant or winter patties, which don’t have pollen in them
Hi solar and welcome to the forum! I second Dawn’s thorough explanations about harvesting and feeding, and have just a little more detail to add. But first, I urge you to address the certain presence of varroa in your hive. No hive in the US escapes having some number of these buggers there, and it’s only a matter of time before they completely crash the party. This typically happens about now thru October/November in our region, as bee numbers reduce in preparation for winter and varroa numbers explode. Varroa mites feed on the fat bodies that the bees raised to make it through winter months crucially need to do so. Untreated colonies very frequently die out in fall and winter as a result. Do an alcohol wash asap to give you a gauge to choose your next steps with treatment, and you can find lots of info about those choices if you search this forum.
About harvesting your Flow frames - woohoo!! You’re in for a treat Follow what @Dawn_SD said, but after the frames are empty it’s very helpful to let the bees clean up the residue before storing them.
I do this by placing the inner cover (with the hole open) under the super/on top of the brood box. With the super accessible just through the hole this way, the bees will be less likely to keep storing nectar up there and focus on bringing remaining honey down to the brood nest for winter. Leave it on for a day or two, then remove it and put it in an airtight container in a protected cold place like a shed or porch. Some beeks use a big Rubbermaid tub, burlap bag or wrap, or placing parchment paper or heavy duty aluminum foil tightly on top and bottom of the super.
About dry sugar feeding, I moisten it slightly with the least amount of water and a few drops of apple cider vinegar to get it to a slightly-damp sand like consistency. You want it to almost hold together and just be less prone to spilling ir scattering when you put a few big spoonfuls of it onto a piece of newspaper that you place directly on the top bars of the frames, under the inner cover.
I use sugar when I’ve run out of winter patties - as Dawn said, there’s a crucial difference between these and pollen patties. Winter patties actually do contain pollen, but a very low amount that will simply substitute for a little bee bread and not spark brood rearing like higher-content patties will. I use these on small, single deep or deep + medium hives that need it. Always check on their consumption rate and be ready to whisk in another half or whole patty accordingly. Try to pick days that have low or no wind and low or no precipitation. If you can’t avoid that, don’t wait if it’s been awhile since you last checked - it’s wayyy better to risk chilling & even killing a handful of bees than to lose the whole colony from preventable starvation.
Feel free to ask me for clarification if you need it
really helps as a buffer for wind and to give you room to put feed in on top the frames. It goes on the brood box, under the inner cover. I actually use two - inner cover is sandwiched between them. Space for food in the lower compartment and a piece of insulation cut to fit the upper compartment just under the outer cover.
Follow what