Another company trying to steal FlowHives design

So far none of my comments have been deleted, I’m actually enjoying messing with them…

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Can’t find it…has the page gone?

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And, Tapcomb is a dumb name. If I bought that I’d expect mead to come out :smile:

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Now there’s a thought, put a hole in the top, add water and then one month later We Have Mead!

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Yes!! that’s the kind of fake news I like :wink:

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Apologies for the silly joke, I am just as incensed as everyone else here, this sort of blatant fake does nothing for competition but to confuse the genuine and fully tested original that has taken years to perfect with a dodgy no name brand that will muddy the water for all potential Flow hive owners when all the problems start flooding social media.

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Ditto to that - meant to mock the impostors for their rude sham & hope they see legal action.

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Image they posted of their frame design is interesting, almost looks like a Flow frame with every second segment removed so more comb is built by the bees, rather than just the ‘slits’ being filled.

It looks like a wire frame without solid/filled cell walls.

hmm, that comb looks unhealthy? And the bees don’t seem to be exactly laying in the honey do they?

that circular photo of the flow frame looks familiar? Have they copied that from Flow promotional material without permission- and with ‘extreme prejudice’? That’s a copyright infringement.

so - this is their proof? They have- after years and years- and “100’s of prototypes” come up with a design that is fractionally different than a flow frame? And they say they started out in early 2014? Before Flow frames were publicly released? What a miraculous thing: they came to a product that exactly mimics the Flow frame by sheer 'coincidence… or- they are Shameless LIARS! They have copied the extraction tubes, the crank key- the main split cell row mechanism, the drainage system, the lug design- complete with adjustment screw, the modified super design, the hive style, the advertising material, the Flow video… Indeed the one thing they seem to claim they have ‘invented’ the offset heights of the alternating rows- is in fact a patented Flow innovation- they have apparently just increased the degree of the offset…

There is no way their minor and unproven cynical alteration will stand up in court- and I cannot see their (most likely non-existent) patents ever getting approved… Especially so if their claim to novelty in the patent is the same as on their facebook page, “the only system where the wax caps do not get broken”.

And they claim to be fans of Flow?

here is what they replied to an extremely rude comment I made to them, it is their ‘Alternate Fact’ response. Kellyanne would be proud:

“I’m sorry you feel this way but the facts don’t support your argument. When did facts not matter anymore? It’s disheartening to spend years working on something with no income, create over 100 different prototypes and then be dismissed in 5 seconds without looking at the facts. We are not a copycat of anyone, evidenced by our patents! No other hive system in the world can harvest honey without breaking the beeswax caps, but Tapcomb does. We had prototypes testing this back in Spring 2014, before anyone knew about flow (who we are fans of btw). 70% of our frames are made by the bees themselves with beeswax, you won’t find another tappable system that is this natural. The feedback we’ve had from bee lovers that have seen or held our frames is that these are major steps forward and great news for bees, as there is nothing our there that causes less disruption. Being a start up is hard enough in this world, all we ask is that you look at the facts before passing judgement. After that, if you still don’t like it then that is fair enough.”

Lordy lord- lies upon lies… Methinks the Lady Doth Protest Too much- and is Guilty of the Crimes they Accuse Others Of.

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Whether it works or not is irrelevant.

Its a Facebook account Dee, still there & not planning on going anywhere. I was informed today that 1 difference is that their frames are coated with wax & bees must build 75% of combs, with the comment “you agree don’t you that wax is important to beekeeping?” ??? What do you say to comments like that?
I think the fact that they are very slow to release full details of the product is either a brilliant marketing campaign or fear of too much & there will be trouble.

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Many fake frames are being sold on ebay also. Probably the same manufacturer. Here is a link - http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/322422366079?lpid=82&chn=ps&ul_noapp=true

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The image I have posted above shows their design differs slightly. Not saying the frames in the video are these frames, but they may actually have a point of difference to the direct copies on eBay.

I have seen at least 3 variants of the knock off counterfeit frames being offered on ebay. One of them does not have external wires- but an internalised bolt. It also has the extraction tube built in- like one of those petrol cans. So they made some changes. But they have still copied the essential mechanism and many other patented details. A friend of mine accidentally purchased some of them off ebay not realising they were fake- the frames did not even fit correctly into a standard langstroth (too tall and too long)- and the mechanism and quality was rubbish. He got refunded and binned them. The same goes for this CrapComb- even if they have made an alteration to the height of the plastic- it is a minor modification intended only to get them around the patents and the frame would still infringe on multiple patented aspects of the basic Flow frame invention.

I doubt there would be any advantage to the modification either- it seems to me it is more likely to leak when you harvest it as well- and the bees will have more work to do repairing the wax after a harvest.

Who could believe their claim that they started developing in early 2014? And by some miracle came up with an invention that looks almost identical to the flow frame in every way except for one minor unproven alteration? It’s all clear lies. They claim they have made 100’s of prototpyes - but cannot provide a single image showing a frame with actual honey stored in it. On their website there is an image of honey coming from a frame- if you look closely you can see the frame look brand new with no propolis- they probably pour honey into the frame- covered it with cling warp- and took that photos as it poured back out. Also the frames in all their promotional lies are yellow plastic- then the one they show above appears to be white plastic. More dodgy business.

They also claim to have patents- but they offer no evidence. Why? I did a search and cannot find any patents that have been applied for. If they do apply: they will fail.

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No one is denying any of this, and these points are fairly obvious to the casual onlooker.

I am just saying, wait until the provide their finished product, and provide feedback on that.

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But why wait? They are acting so dishonestly at this stage- why wait or give them any feedback other than disdain? Even if their frame ends up being a good product (which I doubt) it is still an illegal patent infringement. The Flow frame concept has been patented- these people should put their energies into some other venture- and wait 25 years- and then they can make copies- as can anyone. Legally.

It’s like that Australian company with their (awesome) transportable saw mill- the Lucas Mill: even if the Chinese fakers made a ‘good copy’- and even if they added a few new features that were actually useful- they are still infringing on patents and IP. No matter what these people come up with they will be infringing on multiple aspects of the flow frame patent- that much is abundantly clear from what they have already shown.

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What difference do you honestly think ranting about it on here is going to make? You’re among other people that have purchased the legitimate product, of course you’re going to get support and sympathetic responses. The reality is, people are going to buy this, including Australians, purely because of price.

It’s like you’ve never dealt with China’s manufacturing before. This has been happening for a very long time, many large retailers in Australia ride the back of this kind of infringement and nobody cares because they get their stuff cheap.

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Look- fine-I am preaching to the converted and wasting my time… good point- I will stop now. But let’s- try that shoe on the other foot: why are you wasting your time telling me and others we should wait for their final product? Because you enjoy going against the grain and playing devils advocate? Fine- good for you. If you hadn’t posted what you did- I wouldn’t have responded. Did you want a response? Or the last word?

If Australian people buy this- due to price- they will be importing counterfeit items and breaking the law.

Concerning Chinese manufacturing: my business is based on products manufactured in Taiwan- and some smaller component parts in China. It involves patents, trademarks, etc. I have been involved in Trade mark disputes here in Australia- and know how annoying and unfair it is that companies have to essentially defend themselves at their own expense against other parties who are acting dishonestly. As part of my business I have traveled to Taiwan on multiple occasions to visit the various factories that manufacture things for me- and have been running this business for the last 10 years. I am abundantly aware what’s ‘been happening’ with counterfeiting and perhaps that’s why I am so incensed by this CrapComb. It’s all too familiar…

I will stop my ‘ranting’ now.

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@cowgirl I think you just stumbled on a cultural difference :slight_smile:

I’m not taking a public view either way. I need people to keep posting on this forum - ranting or not - so I have something to read when I get bored with my day job :wink: …and then so I can contribute when I have something useful to chime in with (not like this post)

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Their disinforming makes predictions difficult but I wonder if all they want is a well publicised crowdfunding campaign. Take the money and evaporate.

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