I am getting my first nuc of 5 frames in Spring and am wondering how standard Langsroth frames that I am receiving will mix in with the FlowHive frames since they are wider. Should I just use another 5 Langsroth vs mixy matchy? How to deal w spaces issues or is this not really an issue? Will the super still work ok?
Also, geezer here, hoping to add a medium eventually as brood grows for ease of lifting but looks like earlier Flow Hives couldn’t accomodate? Can super function on standard Langstroth medium? Or more FlowHive frames to purchase. Thanks!
I have a flow hive 2 super on a standard langstroth medium (not flow), which is on the flow brood box. It isn’t an issue, even though the dimensions of the medium are slightly wider than the flow hive, but not enough to create a gap.
Thanks, but my ? is more about the variance in the width of frames. Am I misunderstanding that standard frames are thinner and can I just plunk my nuc in between Flow frames?
I am not sure that I have understood your question properly, but let me have a go at answering, and then you can tell me if I missed the mark.
Your Flow hive brood box is designed to take standard deep Langstroth frames. It has space for either 8 or 10 frames for brood, depending on which size you purchased. When I install a nucleus, I take the 5 frames of bees, brood and honey, and put them into the middle of the brood box, in exactly the same order that they were in the nucleus box. I then put 2 empty Langstroth frames (with foundation) on one side of the nucleus, and fill the other side with either one or 3 frames, depending on the brood box size. It is important for the brood box to have the correct number of frames. Do not space out the 5 frames to fill the box, as it will mess up the bee space in the hive, and you will likely get them building crazy comb between the frames. Some people “checkerboard” the nucleus frames, by putting empty frames between two nucleus frames. I don’t like doing this unless the nucleus is very strong, as you are messing up the bees’ workspace. However, if you are using foundationless frames, this method can help to reduce cross comb-building problems.
Do not mix the nucleus frames with the plastic Flow frames. The plastic Flow frames go in the super above a queen excluder on top of any brood boxes.
The medium should fit fine on top of the brood box, but only use it when the 8 or 10 frames in the lower box are at least 80% full and covered with bees. Do not add the Flow super until the brood box and the medium are full, as it will be too much space for a young colony to heat/cool and defend from pests.
Please ask if I didn’t answer what you were asking, and I will try again!
I quite like having a medium on one of my hives as the bees really do well with the extra honey stores and space. I ended up cutting an old Flow brood box in half and then doing the same with the brood frames, as two deeps was too much for them to handle. It only seemed to be necessary for one colony and was a decision I made after I found they were overcrowded often, and after a full harvest one season, followed by unexpected endless storms I had to pack down the hive and feed them.
A single medium though is not going to be a large enough colony size if you intend this to be the only brood box. Of course two mediums makes up for this, but when it comes to inspecting that likely makes it a little more time consuming with little upside, compared with just removing a few deep brood frames.
Hmm reading over you questions again, are you wanting to keep Flow Frames alongside brood frames and just have a single box hive? It wont be enough space and the Flow Frames will be filled with brood eventually or the nuc might not settle in at all.
The Flow Frames are wider, 3 Flow Frames takes up around the same space as 4 brood frames.
Yes, you did. Thanks for the advice, also. I have 10 frame but now that I’m in bee class, wish I had gone w 8. I am looking at foundation frames to add to nuc, seems easier to buy vs retrofit. And yes, just planning ahead to have medium on the sidelines for when the deep fills up.
Hi, I do have a deep as came w the kit. I am working on my supply list and understand that as my hive grows, a medium on the deep will be easier to manage. Sorry for my poorly phrased question. Thanks for helping.
There is something to be said about having all your frames the same size. It has some advantages:
You only “hold” stock of one size
Frames fit in either super
If you run a single brood super you can rotate frames to help manage swarming
This doesn’t mean they both have to be FD, you could transition to WSP or Manley if weight is an issue.
I have a Flow hive 2+ brood box and super. It’s my first year, and I added a colony of bees from a full overwintered Langstroth hive. They were pumping as we had great weather with a really strong nectar flow. Here in Bavaria we have our last frost May 15, so while the weather was really nice, it switched and we had a week of cold weather with frost and the first warmish day after the week of frost the bees swarmed. When I inspected my brood box. it was jam packed with brood, nectar and honey supplies.
So I‘m curious about your comment on using a medium between the Flow brood box and super so the bees have more space. The bees that swarmed and were hanging in the pine tree were about 1.5 soccer balls in size, or slightly bigger, so it was a lot. Also a lot are still left in my hive attending the brood, so I imagine that cold week huddled up inside was really cramped for them, and I can‘t help but think that had they had more space they might not have swarmed.
You mentioned cutting an old Flow brood box in half along with the foundation-less brood frames and using that instead of 2 deeps which would be a bit to much for the bees. Have I understood you correctly, that a full hive will find the space of the Flow brood box and super to less space, and it is better to add either second brood box? Is this a way of limiting the tendency to swarm?
When a swarm is going to occur preparation takes place about 3 weeks prior and usually it is a sign of strong colony, it sounds like they were holding out for the change in weather as they were likely ready to swarm earlier than this.
Providing more space if a colony is already preparing to swarm won’t prevent the swarm but it can help if you provide this before they have any plans to swarm as it keeps them busy
In my area using two brood boxes is not advised as the extra space can put unnecessary stress on the bees and they don’t generally need the extra honey stores with very mild winters lasting only a couple of months. The smaller box I added was only helpful for 1 of 8 colonies and did not prevent swarming, it was solely to provide them with extra honey stores as they were not quick foragers. As I know they have honey stores in the medium I can harvest with more confidence that they have honey stores, of course I only harvest a few frames at a time anyway.
Two deeps is adequate space for most bee colonies a additional brood box is generally added to provide a colony with space for more honey stores, especially when you need to consider overwintering.
Using two brood boxes doesn’t change a colonies tendency to swarm as it is a natural behaviour, spring management is the best course of action. Actively splitting a hive, removing swarm cells, cycling out old brood frames for new ones, ensuring a hive doesn’t fill to capacity with no space for the bees to work.
That’s really helpful, thank you. Here where I live in Bavaria, the cold weather (usually first frost) is from October though to the last frost in middle of May. That’s six months that the bees hold up inside. Of course warmer days can be later in Oct/ Nov, and earlier in Feb/Mar, but always with the possibility of colder days and nights. Very different to Perth where I‘m from. I‘ll also lean on the wisdom of the local beekeepers here as to whether my hive needs the extra brood box with food supply to get through winter.
Queen cups, to leave or eliminate
On another note, I have ordered a Buckfast Queen (bred and tested) that will come in the last half of May. That is between 1-3 weeks from today, and I‘m unsure whether to leave some queen cups in the hive. From the post swarm inspection this week, I counted 12, which is a lot, and I definitely want to prevent my bees swarming again given the reduced population from this weeks exodus.
The question is, will my bees cope, or be overly traumatised if I remove all the cups now? They have lots of honey stored, and there is really a lot of capped brood for them to look after. Is 1-3 weeks ok for them to wait for their new fertilised queen?
Thanks for the advice, also. I have 10 frame but now that I’m in bee class, wish I had gone w 8. I am looking at foundation frames to add to nuc, seems easier to buy vs retrofit. And yes, just planning ahead to have medium on the sidelines for when the deep fills up.