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Cost comparison


#1

So I eventually got my Flow-Light from the crowdfunder contribution I made. I have 10 Langstroth hives but I purchased the Flow Hive as I am developing a demonstration farm and need alternatives to everything.

I must say that it is an interesting innovation but has yet to be tested over time and, although a very unique way in getting people interested in bees and beekeeping, it won’t take-off in South Africa simply due to price and economics…and the fact that the wood has not been waterproofed with Waxol or similar bee-friendly treatment.

Here is a comparison:
10 frame Langstroth complete (super, brood box, queen excluder, roof and waterproofed with Waxol = ZAR 750-00 delivered.
4 frame Flow-light box incomplete (not assembled, not waterproofed and requires Langstroth additions) = ZAR 6393-00 delivered in town.

I must say that those that have seen it find it very interesting but lose interest totally once they hear the price.

So well done to Flow Hive but I don’t think you’ll be getting much business from the developing countries whose currencies are so weak…which is a pity really.


#2

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#3

The perks on an Indigogo campaign are fund raising prices, not discounted prices. You are taking a calculated risk and hoping to get, at the end of the road, first dibs on a new cool product. Long lead times are not only expected but are stated up front. Delivery dates are expected and estimated and often are optimistic. Some campaigns never deliver at all.

This campaign has been a roller coaster ride from the start. That the Andersons have managed to hang on and keep the wheels from coming off is fantastic. That they are upgrading the product, shipping on time and in some cases ahead of time is nothing short of miraculous. The willingness they are showing to correct errors and addresses QA issues arising from this crazy fast huge ramp up speaks volumes.

I know that it’s expensive. And it’s hard to be patient. And it is always disappointing when something isn’t perfect. But given the parameters of the original project? This is a stellar effort. And I am STILL waiting for mine!!!
; -)


#4

Hi @sara, correct me if I’m wrong, but I seem to remember the Anderson’s stating in the crowd funding video that the perk prices were at a discount & it would get dearer after the campaign, which they did.


#5

Hi there,

Also, if you are comparing honey costs (as opposed to purely owning a beehive) you need to take into consideration of all the other costs related to honey harvesting particularly the extractor and additional frames. You also need to factor in the time and effort it takes to harvest the honey. With the flow hive, all you need is a lever (included) to harvest honey and it is done within 2 hours (depending on climate and type of honey).

I am not saying the flow hive is cheaper, but the comparison needs to be more accurate.

Cheers


#6

In this case I would argue you are wrong. Incentivizing a lower than MSRP price to encourage investment in an innovative new product that has not yet been brought to market does not equate to distribution of a discount product meant to serve a base market. By it’s very nature a product suitable for Indigogo (especially the technology area) would NOT be a likely candidate for some sort of program to aid subsistence communities.

It would be wonderful if sometime far down the road the mature corporation, that will hopefully come from this crowdfunded effort, could spearhead a program that would foster successful beekeeping in disadvantaged communities.

Right now they have to survive the growth pains that might lead to that mature company.


#7

I was referring to the “Flow Hive, Full Reveal” video where Cedar at the 4.44 mark stated that they were offering the flow hive at a discounted rate as a reward to those of you that got in early.


#8

Yes I know, but you were also referring to the OP’s comment about how unfortunate it is that the Flow is so expensive and how much better it would be if it was cheaper. The original comparison made was between the Flow hive and a standard hive kit and how much more expensive the Flow was.

I was pointing out why such an apples and oranges comp may not be a very logical way to look at it. That the Flow, in it’s current incarnation, is not a base sticker price deal.

And that there is discounted and discount, and they are not always the same thing.


#9

Hi @sara, I don’t know how to highlight something someone said. I was only commenting on the bit where you said “The perks on an indigogo campaign are fund raising prices, not discounted prices”. I have nothing to say on the issue of the flow prices vs normal hive prices. I said all that in my infamous video quite a few months ago.


#10

What video was that Jeff?


#11

As I said…It’s a pity as it could really help the developing nations as the rural folk rob wild hives in a very destructive manner.
I’m sure everyone can do there own comparisons. For instance, your 99 quid hive translates to about ZAR 2277.00.
I saw the Flow as an alternate way to keep bees and harvest honey for demonstration and educational purposes.


#12

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#13

@kenstrang there are initiatives in the poorer countries to access and be helped with set-up costs of bee keeping such as Bees abroad - there are also local governments in Africa and other poorer nations that offer incentives and help to encourage, especially women, to become self sufficient and keep bees and the associates tools, equipment and training.

Many of these projects are funded or backed in such a way and that the local resources to do so are within a more acceptable price range. Any of these projects with a Flow hive set up would be making themselves a target of less scrupled people and would not benefit the local community but create unwanted or needed rivalries.

To all of these projects the cost of a Flow set up would wipe out any budget to establish a local business with very few if any benefits gained. Most of the hives in these countries are TBH (Top Bar Hives) and especially in elephant territories the way of stringing the hives together to keep out marauding elephants is to prevent the Pachyderms from destroying plant crops which can also be benefited from the bees pollinating crops.

You would not set up a 5***** restaurant in the streets of down town Delhi - no one could afford to eat there - the amount of equipment, training and help to have bee keepers in these poor rural areas and encourage small enterprise and help them become self sufficient and not live a life of subsistence would be better spent locally on local products so the whole community gains.

I would be nice to think these people could afford and live lives in our “Lap of Luxury” but
“Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime”


#14

@sara my post was not a complaint (although the hive shown was treated and assembled), it was an observation. Another observation is that with in excess of US$12 million raised I would expect them to be on the ball…especially seen as they went back time and again and topped-up the perks…they could have stopped at any time. And yes, I got my hive on time.
@Philip_Waters The extra costs will pertain to new bee-keepers only. I doubt that in the long-term all one will need to do is to turn a lever to harvest honey…there definitely will be some sort of maintenance required to the equipment and, as we know, regular inspections of the hive for diseases and pests. As for extraction, is that not the highlight of keeping bees…a labour of love?
People, I’m not complaining, in fact I think it’s quite cool. What I’m saying is that in South Africa it is not an economically viable method of starting-up as a bee-keeper. It’s really cool for someone who only wants to keep one hive in the backyard solely for honey and lives in a developed country with a strong currency.


#15

@Valli I am aware of that as I am intimately involved in such upliftment projects. In fact, I have just recently established a Trust for such purposes with the excess resources I had.
The Trust’s motto is, ''We don’t hand-out food, we transfer the skills and means to cultivate food."


#16

@DextersShed I’m exploring possibilities, trying to find solutions to an ever-growing problem. Why are you deriding and ridiculing that? Actually don’t bother to answer…I seek positivity not negativity. I wish you a bee-utiful day Sir.


#17

@JeffH What video was that Jeff?


#18

You are correct Jeff; the crowd funding price was the discount price. Prices have already gone up if you want the same red cedar hive. The price is the same if you down-grade to pine woodenware.


#19

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#20

Let’s wait until some time next year to find out how successful the hives are before comparing prices. With the first hives delivered in July, three months ago, we haven’t seen any real positive outcomes yet.